Home - KFA

...energy given to the destruction of man; different ideologies; the communist, socialist, the capitalist and so on. Ideologies, spending enormous energy. All this is the activity of thought.

...desire says, 'I must achieve that something which I experienced yesterday in the sitting quietly, and I want that, I want it to continue'. I practise, I force, I follow a system - all the activity of thought. That's all. What are you objecting...

A religious life, not all the religions, not the monks and all that. They are not religious. I know they would abhor me when I say that. I will show it to you logically why it is not. It is all put together by thought. The invention of god is put there by thought. It is simple. All this is clear when you understand the activity of thought.

My consciousness and yours, if we have been brought up, programmed, conditioned to be individual, then my consciousness is all this activity of thought - fear is thought, we will go into that presently. Pursuit of pleasure is the movement of thought. And the suffering, the anxiety, the uncertainty, the deep regrets, wounds, the burden of centuries...

JK: I think it is again the activity of thought. Thought in its very nature, thought is divisive, fragmentary and therefore I am a fragment.

...it is not, then what is the function of the brain? You understand? If I am not concerned with myself everlastingly in my meditation - you know all that kind of silly stuff, then what place has thought and is there a new instrument altogether which is not the activity of thought? Am I making myself clear? We can see what thought has done in the...

...thought is ever creating is ever in limitation and therefore isolating itself. Therefore in relationship where there is activity of thought there must be conflict. Get it? No, but see the reality of it. See the actuality of this fact, not as an idea, as a something that is happening in my life, in one's active daily life - divorces, quarrels,...

...certain quietness, certain experience and that delights you. You say, 'At last I have got something'. Right? And I say that is the activity of desire, activity of thought, which has projected an image of something to be experienced. And that image can be experienced only through certain practices, certain repetition of words, especially in...

...Thought has invented gods all over the world, for the last millennia upon millennia, those gods are limited, (laughs) naturally. So whatever the activity of thought and its action must always be limited. Therefore thought is not holistic. You understand? If we can realise this simple fact that the thought and the thinker are one, and therefore...

...can thought realise its own limitation? Not say to thought that you are limited, which would be another thought saying - to realise the very activity of thought is limited. Then is there something sacred which is not put together by thought. You understand? Till we understand very deeply the nature of thought, which has its place - right? - I must...

...lack of love, and to have no psychological fear at all. All this implies that one must stand alone. There is a difference between isolation and aloneness, between loneliness and being able to stand by yourself clearly, unconfused, uncontaminated.

K: So instead of going through all that business why don't you find out, let's find out what is thought, whether it can end, what is implied. You follow? Dig!

...Sir, I don't know what is happening to most of the people all the time. But I am saying as one human being we are so conditioned in the pattern of achievement, whether in business, in religion, in any way, we are conditioned to achieve. Now in becoming aware of this conditioning, then you will find in that awareness if you are choosing, if you are...

K: Why does one, I mean, if one is afraid, do you, does one want to go really deeply inside the whole business of it, and be free from it? Does one demand that? Or we don't know how to deal with fears and so we run away from it, avoid it and explain it away. Is that it, we never really want to go into it and completely dissolve it. Is that what is...

K: Could we start: why are we fragmented? Why do we look at life and all our actions and our business, whatever it is, always this fragment, business, religion, love, hate, you follow? It is all so broken up. Why do we do this?

K: Isn't this what is happening in life? Don't say, it is not my business if you are a Communist. It is my business to see if we can live in security, in peace in the world, we are human beings, supposed to be intelligent. Why should I be committed to anything?

...superficial fears of a conscious mind, but also the hidden fears that lie deeply undiscovered. And dependency implies attachment: attachment to a belief, attachment to a tradition, attachment to a person, attachment to the position that gives you status. Now I wish you could see this clearly. In this country status has taken the place of...

...You are free of it, not just verbally say, 'Yes, I am not'. So that is why I asked at the beginning, if I may point out, unless we do this actively, see, aware that it is so in us, and being aware look at it, go into it, search out why human beings hold on to this attachment. Why you are attached as husband, wife, furniture, book, belief, it...

...because if you continue with all your memories, you know, that's it leads nowhere, it leads to what is called death. But if you see the truth of this continuity, then will you ask the question: how is one to end attachment? Take one simple thing, like attachment, how is one to end attachment? You understand my question? How to end attachment...

...on, sir, please. Or if there is an attachment as an individual for another individual, for an object, for an idea, and there is the ending of that attachment - is there any recollection, remembrance, recording of that attachment? Because I think it is important to find this out, for it may lead us to some other quality of a mind that is whole, not...

Now one has explained all this: the attachment to property, attachment to people, to conclusions, to your images, symbols, ideas. To have an insight into that, into the whole of it, is the liberation from attachment, not at some future date, instantly. This is really important to understand. When you listen to this do you say, 'I will think about...

Attachment to the country, attachment to an idea, attachment to a conclusion, attachment to a belief, attachment to a principle, are all the same, they still belong to the stream. So I am saying, what shall a man do when he is no longer selfish? How shall he act politically, how shall he act in relationship with each other, man and woman, how...

...must create disorder. Because being tied implies dependence, the escape from one's own loneliness, fear, and all that. Now to have total insight into this attachment, that very insight clears away all attachment.

...and that pain may come back and be afraid of it - that is, physically. The same thing psychologically. I am attached to you and that attachment I consider love, which is nonsense, it is not love; where there is attachment, there is no love. Obviously. We won't go into that for the moment. So I am attached and I am afraid if I let go my attachment...

So attachment with its pain and pleasure, to be obsessed and to obsess, is part of this attachment, and to be free of that attachment totally, because that is freedom in reality and therefore order in that reality and therefore no friction between human beings. I wonder if you see this. Do you see this, please? Not up here, but with your heart,...

So we have said desire, greed, attachment, is part of our life, daily struggling, conflict, occasionally happy, life. And now, let's examine together, and I mean together, what is fear, why we are so frightened. And this problem of fear has not been solved at all though we have lived a million years, we are still carrying on in the same old...

We were saying that freedom is not at all possible through any system, both outwardly and inwardly - freedom cannot be brought about through any political or economic system, either through communism or capitalism; no religion, organised, can ever bring about this freedom; nor following a particular little group, separate from others. We went into...

So there must be freedom from fear, from hurts, from every kind of thing human beings have put together. There must be freedom, you understand, not just words. 'India must be free from the rest of the world'. That's just nonsense. Nobody can live by themselves, they need a friend, they need somebody to help them.

So, can you observe, be aware that one has these formulas, concepts, opinions, judgements, which denies freedom - you follow? - and it is only when there is freedom there is energy, there is this passion, obviously. Now are you aware of your conclusions?

K: (Repeating) Do you have to be alone to be free, and in that freedom what is relationship with another human being. Cannot there be freedom in that relationship.

First of all, one can see very clearly freedom is essential. Not freedom from something, a prisoner wanting freedom which means away from a prison. First he is caught in a prison, then he wants freedom to leave that prison. That is only a reaction. That reaction is not freedom. Freedom implies the total ending of all illusions, of all belief, of...

...So to find out, to discover, to come upon that extraordinary thing called love one must have a very clear understanding of our daily life. And that means psychologically, inwardly, we have no freedom. We talk about freedom, especially in this country where you have experts to tell you what to do - specialists. I don't know, you must be aware of...

...uncertain, depressed - do you follow? - the whole process of our activity. And security - there is such a thing as security. But that demands a great enquiry. Security in freedom. Freedom is not from something: freedom from fear, freedom from anxiety and so on. Those are all partial, limited. That freedom is not limited. Is there such freedom? And...

So to look, to learn about oneself there must be freedom from all conclusion. I am ugly, I don't want to look at myself. I don't know what I shall find in myself. I am afraid to look at myself. You know all the things that we come up with. So, can one observe without any sense of condemnation? Because if there is condemnation it is one of the...

So is there a freedom which is totally unrelated, which is absolute - we are using the word 'absolute' in the sense absolved, free from any causation, from any motive. And is it possible for a brain, for a human mind, the immense struggle, the conflicts, the miseries, the loneliness, can there be a freedom from all this, so completely away from...

So what is freedom? Enquire, sir. The question is involved in that. What is freedom? To move from trap to trap to trap? To move from one kind of misery to another kind of misery? I am married, I am bored with my wife, I want a divorce and I go, because I like or love, or whatever word one uses, to another woman; but the same pattern is repeated....

...that: which is, to understand desire, desire is sensation - I will go into it, I will explain it a little bit. There is seeing the tree, the woman, the man, the car, the politician who is right on the top, or the guru who says, 'I know'. So perception, seeing, then contact, touching, then out of that sensation. Right? Is this clear? Then what...

...Ah, you don't understand the word 'technology'. Technique - to do something, say for instance you want to build a car, and you must know all the parts, put them together, they must all work together. I have dismantled a car, put it all to pieces, and then put it all together hoping it will work. But it did work. Right? Learning about all the...

...That's right, sir, that's right. What do we mean by danger? A car is coming towards you as you are crossing the road and you might die and all the rest of it, so you move away from it. Self-preservation - the instinct to preserve one's being, both physiologically as well as psychologically. Now is not conflict similar to that? Let's keep it very...

...the reaction. You see something in the window and you want it. What has taken place? The seeing of that dress, that trouser, that coat, that car, that woman, that man, or whatever it is - seeing, the sensation, the contact and say, 'I like that, that's exciting'. Which is, thought creates an image, you sitting in the car and driving. You follow?...

...I don't know. That is, there are events in one's life, happenings, that appear to be a chance, happens by chance. Events that occur in random, you know, not knowing, it happens. Is that happening new, totally unexpected, or is that happening the result of unexamined, hidden, unconscious events? Just a minute, just a minute. I happen to meet you,...

...No, just Please, don't Go slowly, please. First I want to be clear that the difference between change and transformation, a mutation, if you want to use that word. Change implies changing 'what is' into 'what should be'. Right? Into 'what should be' is already established, by thought, by environment, by circumstances, by pressures and so on, so on...

...am asking myself, can this violence in me end completely, never to come back again? Are you asking this question? Will you ask that question of yourself? Cause time is not going to change you. So what will end this violence instantly? What happens to a brain, to your brain when you see the logic of this: that time does not change you under any...

So we are asking, my friend and I together: is it possible for us to change? Not change to something else, that is only a becoming. When you change what you are to what you should be, that is a form of becoming. Right? So that is no change at all. I wonder if you understand this? If I am greedy, or schizophrenic, or utterly committed to some kind...

...One has to go into this question rather carefully. First of all we have to understand what do we mean by change? Change from this to that - right? - we generally mean that. Change from what one is into what one should be. Is that change at all? You follow my question? I want to change from what I am, with my greed and all the rest of it, and...

...biologically, psychologically, in every way, atom, cells, all that is me. And I am that. So I am humanity. That has to me tremendous meaning. And I am there and I say, is there any change at all possible? I thought change existed in climbing the hill and going to the source, but I find I am still there. I have never left it. I thought by going up...

So what is it that brings about change? You are following all this? Somewhat at least. Thought obviously cannot. It can organise change. Organisation is put together by thought. It can plan change but the planning is limited. So when one realises, sees the fact, the truth that thought cannot possibly bring about a change, because thought itself is...

K: The desire to change, is that not also measurable. Of course it is. So you have to find out what you mean by change. Change from the known to the unknown? Or change from one corner of the field to another corner of the field. You understand? So please be good enough to find out for yourself why you are discontent, and whether you go to the ends...

So change implies non-movement of thought. This is - you see. Right? Because thought says, 'I want that'. I have had that had sufficient, 'I must have that'. And so it is constantly moving from this to this to this to this. And that is what we call change, generally. And we are saying no, that is not change at all. Change implies when thought has...

That is, to be aware of 'what is' in oneself. Right? One may be conscious that one is envious, or violent, and to change, to bring about a change in that violence you need time. Is that so? You are following this? Please, are you? Is there somebody to whom I can talk and who'll tell me they understand?

So some of you have listened for many years and do we listen and therefore bring about a change, or you have got used to the words and just carry on? So we are asking: what will make man, a human being who has lived for so many million years, carrying on the same old pattern, inherited the same instincts, self preservation, fear, security, sense...

So, sirs, it is important to understand the nature and the structure of relationship. To change this corrupt society you must change, you must change yourself radically. And during all these talks we are concerned about that only: to bring about a mutation in the very mind, in the very cells of the brain.

...life, which is relationship, must inevitably be a series of incidents and conflicts. That's clear. So we are asking: can this centre be understood, watched, see the nature of it, the structure of it, and end it - not verbally, but actually end it? Right? That is our question. Therefore one must observe freely the nature and the structure of the...

K: Which is, have you, who have understood or seen the truth that you are an individual and therefore no longer - are you still carrying the memories, the structure, the nature of your remembrance, your past, all that, in your mind? Yes, sir, this is a real question, don't...

K: I'm not asking, saying this personally. You're attached to somebody. And you see the whole business of attachment, what is involved, the whole structure, nature of it, the consequences of it. And you end it. Right?

So can we go into it? This instrument and the nature. We have talked about 'what is' from the first time we met you, but what is the nature of this 'what is'?

K: So we talked, I spent hours, we discussed, we went into it. Gradually he saw. He said, 'Quite right'. So, sir, unless we understand the nature and the structure of appetite and desire, which are more or less the same, we cannot understand very deeply pleasure.

K: All right. So you are part of nature, you are saying. What is your relationship with your nature - all those flowers, all the hills, the trees, the mountain, the dry river - right? - what's your relationship to that?

...Exploiting. Obviously. That's nothing new - nature has been exploited by man for thousands of years. They are destroying the forests, they are polluting the rivers, they are polluting the air, they are killing animals for pleasure, for food. This has been going on for millions of years. And so when one asks, what's your relationship with nature,...

K: Completely, specially in big towns, and even in small villages, and hamlets man is always outwardly going, outward, pursued by his own thought, and so he has more or less lost touch with nature. Nature means nothing to him. It is very nice, very beautiful. Once I was standing with a few friends and my brother many years ago at the Grand Canyon,...

And we are going to talk about together the nature of what we consider love. This has been a question that has existed among the ancient Egyptians, the ancient Hindus, and recently the Christian world and the Islamic concept; they have all preached, talked about loving your neighbour, and so on. This has been asserted, religiously, in all the...

...bear in mind we are going to make it much more orderly, strict and not make it into another resort for amusement, please. Though it has been announced several times, that music that goes on, what is called music - Bong(?) is it? - thumping on the drums and so on went on until half past ten last night. So please be courteous, careful of others and...

...Rien n'est completement. Look sir, when you listen to music, there is the beauty of it, the romanticism of it, the remembrance of it, hearing it in different places, and the association that it evokes, that music, with whom you heard it, how you talked about it, what the critics said about it and so on. So when your mind is occupied then the space...

K: Go and listen to music. The moment that music stops you are back to your images. This is all so childish! Take drugs, that also creates various images.

K: Thought, quite right. But sir, to go so profoundly it requires tremendous, not only courage, but the sense of constant pursuing the same stream.

K: No, no, sir. Is courage the opposite of fear? That is, if fear is non-existent is it courage? Or it is something totally different?

I am not, the speaker has never been pessimistic or optimistic, he is just showing something to you: that the computers can take over all that man has done - almost, except the computers can't look at the beautiful tree, or the evening star, single, alone in the sky, or the morning light on the waters. When a machine can take over all that you are...

May we stop now? It is an hour and a quarter we have talked. You haven't talked but K has talked. But we have had a communication with each other, because we have established the basis of a communication in which there is no superior and the inferior, one who knows and one who does not know. May we get up? Apres vous: After you! (laughter)

...we go into that this morning? Can we freely enquire together into this question? Because communication and relationship always go together. If there is no communication there is no relationship, not only between you and the speaker but also between each other. If we merely remain at the verbal level, at the formal level, that communication is very...

...course not. Sir, when you hold a hand of another, you can hold it out of habit or of custom. Or you can hold it and communication can take place without a word, because both are at the given moment intense, communication has taken place, without a word. But we are not intense, passionate,...

You know that word, 'communication' is very important to understand. Communication means building together, creating together. The word itself means that. And here we are trying to communicate, the speaker is trying to communicate with you, who are the listener, which means the listener and the speaker are creating together. Therefore, you're not...

...all these questions of yourself. If you have - I am not suggesting that you should, or that you must, but as two friends talking over together, each points out to the other, asks questions of each other, doubts what the other fellow is saying, so there is interaction between the two, there is a communication. And communication implies not only a...

K: (Repeating) Could we go into communication and attention. All right, sir, let's talk about communication and attention. Any other thing?

...in English we have to understand the meaning of words, how they are used. And in this communication, that is, in listening to what is going to be said, either we share in what is being said or merely translate what is being said into ideas, into abstractions. Either we share together what is being said and not translate it into an ideology, into...

...with the psyche, the mind, and from there moving outwards. I don't know if we are communicating with each other. Communication means, as we said the other day, learning together, sharing together, observing together, creating together. That is, really, that means communication. So we must, you and I, must both move together step by step, and not...

Listen not only verbally, and the meaning of the word, but also non-verbally - for communication is verbal and non-verbal, and since we are speaking in English, the words have definite meaning and if you don't understand the meaning of the word actually but interpret that word according to your particular conditioning then you will not be listening to what is being said.

K: I understand that, sir. But I want to find (laughs), not a drug, not a medicine, not a way, but there must be a communication between you and me who is the ordinary man, a communication so that the communication is so strong that very my act of listening to you and you communicating with me operates.

So, the next question, which is much more difficult to answer - you have to have patience so far. Patience means - please understand, patience - I am using the word 'patient' in a particular sense. Patience means the absence of time. You understand? Generally patience means go slow, be patient, take time, don't react quickly, be quiet, take it...

K: Wait, wait, wait, wait. Patience, patience. The gentleman says, if I have understood him rightly, to bring about this order should we give first place to god. That's right, sir? That's a question isn't it?

...give you comfort, which will psychologically make you feel secure. That you love, which is what you want, you love. Right? Be ruthless in this. So devotion is not love, which is different from respect. You understand? Devotion is totally different from respect. That is, to respect another, care for another, consideration for another. But you only...

...Nobody has said that to me, here or in India or anywhere else. Perhaps one or two have. But I'm asking you, out of politeness, kindness, etc., respect, what do you pay for something which is unpayable.

...of a guru is fear. Right? The respect that you have for your bosses, for your politicians, for your gurus, for your so-called higher authorities, that respect which is never shown to those below you, politically, religiously, morally, ethically, in business, is really a cowardice. Are you accepting all this? The word 'respect' means to look back....

K: What is real friendship, if in that there is no trust or respect. If there is no trust or respect, what is the meaning of real friendship? I don't know. (Laughter) If you haven't got respect and affection how can you have friendship? I don't quite understand the meaning of this question.

K: Scrap books and conditions, sir, let's talk together freely. So I say to myself, Why? Is this the result of all this? Environment, culture, education, religion, the economic social structure which makes me consider myself first, my view, my union...

K: That's very important because religion, at least the meaning of word is to gather together to be attentive. That is the true meaning of that word, religion, I have looked it up in a dictionary.

...we are going together find out what is meditation. Which is to ask what is a religious mind, what is religion? One can see what religion is not. Religion is not all the things that are going on in the world, the churches, look at what happens in the churches, in the cathedrals, in the temples, in the mosques, in the Tibetan shrines and so on,...

...business of living, we are not educated to look and see what happens if we face death. So I was wondering as we came along this morning, religion, which we were going to discuss anyhow, has become merely not only a divisive process but also utterly meaningless. Maybe 2,000 years as Christianity, or 3,000, 5,000 as Hinduism, Buddhism and so on, it...

And why has man always talked about religion? From the ancient Egyptians and before them, religion has played an extraordinary part in life - why? Is it that we are seeking happiness, peace, an end which will not be destructive, secure, peaceful, and demanding that and not finding it in life, not finding all that in our daily life, we project....

The word 'religion', the root of it, has not been established. I think from observing and looking into various dictionaries, it really means gathering together all energy to find out the truth. I think that is what it means, after looking at various French, English, Italian dictionaries. It implies also diligence and negligence. A mind must be...

...we are going to enquire into that. That is, what is religion? Please understand, we have talked about fear, we talked about psychological wounds, not to carry for the rest of one's life. We talked and have gone into it together, what is relationship, the significance of relationship. Nothing can exist on earth without relationship, and that...

K: You see when we have divorced conduct from religion, which we have, divorced relationship from religion, which we have, divorced death from religion, which we have, divorced love from religion, when we have made love into something sensuous, something that is pleasurable, then religion, which is the factor of regeneration, disappears in man.

...at your japam and your repetitions of whatever you repeat. You don't say, 'Why am I doing this? What is the reason, what lies behind all this?' You follow tradition and therefore you think that's religion. You know, in India somebody calculated three hundred thousand gods. It is perhaps better than having one god. You can choose anything you like....

...a belief, drugged by following somebody. This demands, please, that you be a light to yourself, not the light of another, light which comes through enquiry. And religion is sceptical enquiry. Religion is that. Religion isn't all the circus that goes on in the world - the puja, the rituals, the worship of idols, worship of symbols in the Christian...

...answer it, tell you, but together we are going to find out, remembering that there is no speaker but only the mirror in which you are looking. To understand it we must go into the question of what is love. Because if we can find the truth of what is love that may completely dissolve the centre, completely bring about a holistic action. So we must...

And is being attached to a person, or to a country, to an idea, is that love? Attachment, dependence. Please look into yourself, not listen to me, I am not worth listening to. But what is significant, what is worthwhile is that you listen to yourself when these questions are being put, you have to answer it for yourself because it is your daily...

And if there is no love and compassion, nothing exists. You understand? The love that we have is not love, it is based on pleasure, maternal instinct - you understand what I am saying? - which you have derived from the animals. The love of one's wife or one's husband or one's children is still me and you. And with that love and compassion goes...

So, we have these two questions: a life in which the very living is the beauty of action and love. And without love there is always the right and wrong action breeding conflict, contradiction and opposition. And there is only one true action, one action, only one action and there is no other action, which is the action that comes out of love, and...

...it, but to look at it, to understand it, to investigate it, to unravel it. In the unravelling process of that you will understand fear and pleasure. And also you will see the meaning of what love is. It is stripped of all sentimentality, because sentiment can become cruel, like emotionalism. And then you will find out for yourself what that thing...

And we have a great deal of suffering in what is called love. Love, as we know it now, is pleasure, sexual or the love of a country, or the love of an idea, and so on, so on, so on - all derived from pleasure. And when that pleasure is denied there is either hatred, antagonism or violence. And can there be love, not just something personal between...

...of all yesterday we were talking about something very important, it seems to me at least. We were saying, what is love in relationship with each other. That was the thing we were talking about yesterday - the love that exists between man and woman, the love of a mother with her baby, the love of one's country and so on and so on, so on. We were...

...What is it that will answer all these questions? Would not all these questions be answered when you have absolute unconditional psychological freedom? And freedom means love, not anything else. Love is not desire, pleasure, sensation, attachment. And where there is love, there's compassion and that unlimited intelligence. When it's there, you've...

K: No, no don't reduce it to the 'me'. B is of that stream. B says to his girl friend or boy friend, 'I love you' - love is that love?

You know, one of our difficulties is we have associated love with pleasure, with sex. And love also, for most of us, means jealousy, anxiety, possessiveness, attachment. That is what we call love. So is love attachment? Is love pleasure? Is love desire? Is love the opposite of hate? If it is the opposite of hate, then it is not love. Right? Do you...

Please sirs, for God's sake, this is too serious to take photographs, please! Sir, this requires your attention if you want to understand fear and whether the mind can ever be free from fear. So this is very serious because fear is a dreadful thing for all of us. It darkens our lives. It shrivels us. It makes us so shallow, petty, little, living...

K: Yes. So, no, we are skirting around this. Why? Why do I want security so that I feel completely content, without fear, without anxiety, without agony and so on? Is fear the root of all this?

K: Is fear itself watching itself? Please don't guess. Don't come to any conclusion. Find out. The mind isn't escaping from fear, not building a wall against fear through courage - you know, all the rest of it. What takes place when I watch? I ask myself naturally, who is watching? Right? Who is watching the thing called fear? Don't answer me...

So fear is a remembrance, the thing that is over. It is over but the brain retains it and recognises a feeling which it calls fear, because it recognises it verbally, and absorbs it into the past. I don't know if you follow this. You understand, sir?

...what takes place? Let's first hold it for a minute. Are you all following all this? As we said, are we observing fear through the process of memory, which is recognition, the naming - right? From that the tradition says, 'control it', the tradition says, 'run away from it', the tradition says, 'do something about it so that you are not...

...So wait. Then you say, if I don't have these images, pictures, conclusions and so on I am nobody. So fear of being nobody creates these pictures. Right? The fear of being nobody is conditioned by society, by your parents and so on, so on, they say you must be somebody. Right? You must be good at mathematics, you must be good at being a professor,...

So shall we discuss first, talk over together first fear and then freedom, or the other way round? Or do they both go together? I think they both go together. So let us concern ourselves if the mind can be really, very deeply free of this thing called fear. Are you really interested in this, are you sure you are interested in it? Because if we go...

...insight, I see it has no value, it has no meaning. The seeing is the intelligence. That's all. Now I want to have an insight into fear, into attachment, so I don't condemn it, I don't say I must be free of it, I just look at it, I want to learn about it. Therefore when I want to learn, I'm curious, I don't say, 'I must have no fear, I must go...

K: Sir, and also thought helps you to protect yourself, doesn't it, through insurance, through building a house, avoiding wars. Thought cultivates fear and also protects, doesn't it? So we are talking about thought creating fear, not how it protects. Come on, please, is that all right, may I go on?

Look sir, we may live long years, full of travail and sorrow and pain and pleasure and fear. The body, the organism wears out through misuse, through disease, through constant conflict inwardly, the good and the battle that goes on inwardly, the right and the wrong, the good and the bad, I am a Hindu, and you are a Muslim, I am a Christian, you...

...on this earth over fifty thousand years, and perhaps much longer or for less duration. During all this long evolution man has not found peace on earth - 'pacem in terris' has been preached long before Christianity, by the ancient Hindus and the Buddhists. And during all this time man has lived in conflict, not only conflict with his neighbour but...

...Yes sir. There are several organisations that talk about peace in the world, various groups that are talking about peace in the world - pacem in terris. The pope says it, other religious organisations assert it - you must have peace on earth. And you are asking, if I understand rightly: are there individuals, groups, organisations that are working...

...with the world, with the environment of which he is part. And until we understand this problem and find out for ourselves whether there is a possibility of completely ending conflict, totally, then we shall never be able to live at peace with ourselves and so with society. It's only a mind that is completely peaceful, not asleep, which has not...

So what is peace and how can we establish and lay the foundation so that we build on that - psychologically speaking? You understand sirs, we are talking over together. I am not pointing out. The speaker is not the authority but in talking over together things become very clear. If we can talk over together without any bias, without any prejudice,...

...that life is a process of relationship. Why in our relationship with each other, however intimate, sexual, however very close, why there is conflict? Why two people cannot live peacefully? Have you ever asked that question? Why? Because this is very important. If I don't know how to live peacefully with my wife, with my husband, with my...

Man has evolved probably a million years or less or more biologically, and man has always been crying for peace on earth; pacem in terris, the old Latin phrase. And apparently there is no peace in the world; without peace we cannot possibly flower. We can possibly, not evolve, but see the extraordinary depth of life, the beauty of it; the...

...all want to end war, at least some people do. And pacem in terris, that is, peace on earth, in Latin, is not possible, apparently, in this world, in spite of demonstrations, in spite of all the preaching of the priests and religious books and so on, we can never have peace in this world apparently. And we never ask if one can live peacefully in...

...sorrow in the world. They are still doing it. How many women, men, wives, have cried about this. For thousands of years, and nobody stops it. They talk about peace on earth; they don't mean it. To have peace on earth one has live peacefully. And that peace cannot be brought about through legislation. Peace means a state of mind, brain, where there...

...have talked about a great many things. We are together going into very complex problems this morning: why human beings have not been able to live at peace within themselves and so peace with the world. Why our daily life is in such confusion, conflict and misery and sometimes joy, why is it, after all these thousands of years, man has not found...

So I want peace and I find peace can be had at a certain price and I am willing to pay for that. But I resist every other method of achieving, peace. I know all that, so I say to myself: can I live completely, right through my whole being without resistance? Not that I must resist this or that, follow this person and not that person - can I live...

So if that is true then what is order in relation to action? You understand? All our action now is based on thought, on conclusions, on memory. And we are saying, as long as thought, which is limited, which has created an ideology and acts according to that ideology, there must be total disorder. We are saying that, which is a fact, if you observe...

...hurt and the consequence of it is you resist, you build a wall around yourself, gradually you become more and more lonely, withdraw and from that you act. Therefore your action is distorted. Your action then is violent and so...

So is there an action in our daily life which is both skilful and not perpetuating the self? That is one problem. Because through our education we have developed, through experience, this enormous skill, and therefore it has given us a great deal of strength, vitality and comfort in the realm of skill and therefore perpetuating the self. Now is...

...that requires a great deal of attention, quiet enquiry, hesitant examination, not, 'Tell me what to do and I will do it'. Because everything is falling to pieces around us and there must be action of a totally different kind. Not action according to anybody, even according to the speaker. We are going in to find out for ourselves what is action,...

So, any action on my part - please listen to this! - any action on my part, which is part of my conscious the content is still it cannot uncondition, it cannot be unconditioned that way. Then what am I to do? You have got it, sir? I will not reject or accept it. It is a fact.

K: You can't reject anything. You are just There it is. Now what is the action that takes place when you observe you can't do anything?

So one is asking: is there an action, in daily life - the daily life which we know, what it means, what is involved in it - where action is always free? And this action is possible only when there is insight born of intelligence. Right? I wonder if you get it! Am I making it clear? Verbally perhaps, but dig deeply, have insight into it, into what...

K: Which of these questions shall we take: relationship, the stream of suffering in which we live, and how to step out of it, and if you do step out of it what is action in the world of reality, that is, what is the action in our daily life? And the other is, noise - but I'm afraid that is (laughs) - and when one suffers it seems that one loses...

...anger is me, why cannot I see that the whole characteristics, the idiosyncrasies, the vanities, the hurts, is part of me, is me? Why don't you see that? If you see that, then what is the action? There is no action, there is no action. You understand? We are used to action, to do something about ourselves, therefore we say, the thing we observe, we...

As we were saying, that without understanding the content of consciousness, and perhaps going beyond it, any action, however significant it may be, without understanding the fragmentary nature of our consciousness, whatever our action, however significant it may be, must produce confusion. I think this must be very clear. It's like giving a great...

...Do think about it a minute. We don't understand what relationship means. Because I come along and say, look, let us talk as two friends, which implies care, affection, love, consideration, involvement, commitment, and you sit there and say, 'You go on talking, but...' You would never say that to your wife or husband or girlfriend or boyfriend...

...also I would like to point out: I think we don't listen; we don't really try to find out what the other person is trying to say. And listening requires certain attention, care, affection. If I want to understand what you are saying I must listen to you, not block myself all the way, all the time. I must care for what you are saying, I must have...

...Ah, not we have to love. That is not an action of will. If there is to be an understanding of 'what is', and 'what is ' may be violence, greed, brutality, cruelty or affection or joy - awareness implies great care in looking. When you have a baby don't you - the mother cares infinitely with affection, gets up at two, three or four o'clock in the...

K: That's it, sir. There is not even affection to understand something. If you and I had affection - if you had affection and I had affection for you, and I say, look, for god's sake, do look at this, and because you have affection for me, or love for me, and what I say becomes important to you.

Krishnamurti: Yes. I think that is affection, that is love. When you talk to my waking consciousness, it is hard, clever, subtle, brittle. And you penetrate that, say, all right, keep your own beastly little stuff, and you penetrate it with your look, with your affection, with all that feeling you have. That operates, not anything else.

K: ...you protect it with affection, taking it in your lap, cuddling him or her, and holding his hand, you make him feel that he is loved, that he is cared for. That gives him a feeling, here is somebody who is looking after me, and there is security here.

K: No, just sir. This is really for half an hour, do please put your minds to this, I beg of you. Are you different from your aggression? Obviously you are not. You are aggression, it is part of you.

K: Oh, no. No, no, no, no, you have not understood what we have said. Both arise, love and aggression, they have no formulas. Really, that is not what we are talking about.

THIRD QUESTION: How does one meet aggression and psychological attack from a close relative from whom one cannot escape? (Laughter)

So we are saying, observe without direction, attachment, or aggression, or your violence. Observe it without any motive, direction, desire, just to observe it, and in that very observation there is an ending of it. And therefore you are inviting death while living. You follow? I wonder if you understand this? Not commit suicide, that's another...

...me, is that a form of vanity? It's like a man who is vain, as most of us are, and out of that vanity we try to be humble. Is that humility? A man who is full of aggression, violence, tries to be modest. You understand? It's absurd, it's lost its meaning. Whereas, a man who is aggressive realises, sees what aggression has done in this world and all...

...in our relationship when you are nothing? You understand? You know what it means to be nothing? No ambition, which doesn't mean you vegetate, no competition, no aggression, no resistance, no barriers built by hurt - you are absolutely nothing. Then what is it to be related to another? Have you ever thought about all this, or is it all so...

...American girls and boys, and it is now spreading throughout the world, have sex very early. Don't be shy, this is happening. They want to have all the experience immediately - swimming, anything - experience - skiing. So they want, as they are young, they want to experience everything at once in a short time. Right? So as they grow older, see what...

K: That's right, sir. I think, my experience is, as long as I remain a Hindu I am completely secure - that's my experience, I am that experience and that's what destroys biological survival. Can you give that up?

...Not very. You see sir, would you go into this a little bit? Experience is always limited - right? I may blow up that experience into a kind of fantastic affair and then set up a shop to sell my experience, but that experience is limited. And so knowledge is always limited. And this knowledge is operating in the brain. This knowledge is the brain....

K: Because the experience leaves a mark on the brain as experience and therefore there is memory of it, and this memory, you are saying, divides.

So when the brain and the mind and the body are absolutely quiet, that is, when there is no entity that is measuring all the time, comparing - 'I have had this experience yesterday and I'd like to have it more, or I would like to have further experience,' which is all measurement.

So knowledge, experience is limited. Knowledge is limited. That is clear if you observe historically the process of science, from the Galileo, from the ancient scientist to the modern scientist they have been gradually building up day after day, and based on experience. So knowledge is based on experience. So knowledge and experience are limited....

Sirs, you see throughout the ages man has sought something which is beyond time, which is beyond thought, beyond all experience, something totally the origin of all things. He wanted it, he wanted to enquire, find out. And there were those people who said, 'I have found out, I will tell you all about it.' They were caught in that trap. And that is...

...I am going into it. So in meditation there is no experience. Right? I wonder if you see that. This is very important to understand. Experience implies, the word 'experience' means to go through, not to hold something back, to go through and finish. The meaning of that word. And also in experience several things are implied. When you have an...

K: No, I am showing you something. There is no experience when the observer is not. Experience implies a recognition. Right? Recognition means that it has already been experienced, stored up in the memory as an experience and remembered, which is the observer. Now when the observer is not what takes place?

...- there are ten different conclusions, opinions, expressions. Now what is one to do? Which is the right thing in this? Your opinion or my opinion, your experience or my experience, how do we find out the truth of any matter?

K: No, but that's not I'm saying, the source of fear of every kind that human beings have is born from thought. Will you listen to that statement, as you would listen when I say I really love you? Because it's too simple, your mind immediately says, 'No, that's too damn simple, it's not, it is much more complicated than that'.

So what will bring us together? Belief won't, authority of any kind is rejected, the reward by another as a means for you to change is also rejected. And if you say you are going to be punished in heaven for not obeying, you say 'Go away, don't be silly', and you pass him. So what will make us come together?

K: Are you saying no? When are you then generous? When are you feeling affectionate, kind, generous, sympathetic? Or do you never feel it? Or only occasionally?

K: That's what I'm I am coming to that, madame. Look at it, sir. He is attracted to it, attracted to all that, and he won't listen to my talk. He kind of avoids me. Right? Don't you know all this, as parents? No?

K: Who invented exams? (Laughter) The Chinese? The Mandarins? I believe they were the original people who kind of invented this monstrous system.

JK: Yes, it is the activity of thought. Now if I consciously meditate, practise, do all this kind of what I call nonsense, then you are making the brain conform to another series of patterns.

...when given an opportunity it breaks through. Which is it? I've seen so many people in - I've lived a long time - from the age of fifteen I've seen this happen, with people of my own age - begin beautiful, you know, and gradually finish, destructive, cruel, brutal, self-centred, ugly, drunk.

I am anger, am I not? Anger is not something separate from me. I am greed, envy, anxiety. Right? I like to think that is something separate over which I have control. But the actual fact is I am all that - even the controller is me. Right? So there is no division between greed, anger, jealousy, and so on - that is me, that is the observer. Right?...

K: How do I know that anger is a fact and the opinion about anger is a conclusion. Right? Don't you know? The opinion, the judgement about anger is a conclusion. And the fact I'm angry is a fact. For the love of god.

K: Look, sir, can you watch, is there an observation of that feeling without naming it? The moment you say, anger, it is violence. Right?

K: Sir, look at it in yourself. At the moment of jealousy, or of anger, or of envy, or of hate, whatever it be, happiness, at that second there is no division, is there?

We are saying: what takes place when the observer is the observed which is anger? You can test this out for yourself. Don't accept a thing the speaker is saying, because if you accept, repeat, then you are second-hand human beings, which you are. So, please have the courtesy, the dignity, the intensity not to accept anything, psychologically. So,...

So the hurt is not different from me, the 'me' is the image, and that image gets hurt, so I am that image. Like anger is not different from me, I am anger. I might think I am different but in actuality I am anger. So do you see the truth of it - not the idea of it? the actual truth that when you are angry that anger is you.

K: Wait, careful, don't agree so quickly. You are not different from all that. Right? Are you different from anger? No, of course not. So you are anger. Right?

...it. Before I am aware or anything, I say to myself, is it possible for me to watch - casually, I'm playing with it, I am having a game with myself. I am watching the movement of anger arising. I think that's fairly simple. Right? I think you've noticed all that, haven't you? No,...

...what happens when you when the observer is the observed. You understand? When the anger is me, then what takes place? Have you enquired into this or you just say, 'Yes, I am the observer, the observed'? Meaningless. But to find out or experience, go into it and find out if anger is always different from you. That has been the tradition, that has...

Sir, we have the idea, a concept, a tradition that I am different from my anger. I am the atman and all that kind of stuff, I am different from everything, I am the watcher. Right? I am the controller. As that gentleman points out very clearly, that if I don't do anything now, that is, I won't be attached, I won't do anything about my attachment,...

Popular Quotes

aloneness

place

integration

form of dependency

love

form of conclusion

Topic Posts

War and Peace

Introduction to Krishnamurti

Anxiety

Relationship

All Topics

About the Portal

Topic Posts

Introduction to Krishnamurti’s teachings

Anxiety

Relationship

Receive Our Articles By Email